RE: The 'user' in User Manual

["Lauren" <lt34 -at- csus -dot- edu>]

Richard,

I don't use wiki because it is unreliable since anyone can change it.  It is
good entertainment though.

You have still missed that my discussion was about semantics and not
grammar.

> Well, we weren't discussing the weather or Super Bowl. The 
> topic was how one should write user guides. The choice of 
> person and mood are key aspects of this. I don't restrict 
> myself to everyday terms when describing software 
> configuration -- why must I do so when describing the 
> mechanics of writing? 

We were discussing the use of the word "you."  And I responded with a
semantical not grammatical discussion of thought processes that a reader
takes while reading technical documentation.  It is important when
discussing semantics to not be distracted by grammar.  Grammar defines the
rules of documentation and semantics governs the function that gets
documented.  Semantics was my discussion and whatever grammatical rules a
writer uses is up to that writer, but we should not obsessively fixate on
grammatical rules before we have even left the discussion of whether an
author should write himself or the audience into the document.  You do not
seem to understand the subject matter.

> Please cite the message where, as you say, I said "Don't use 2nd 
> person voice."

2/2/2007, 1:52 PM:
> connotation.  I take a neutral stance in my writing and avoid 1st 
> ("I"), 2nd ("you"), and 3rd ("user") person voices.

Where on earth is it true that my stating that "I" adhere to practice says
or implies that that "you" should adhere to a practice?  Richard, you are
taking an irrational leap of language here.

I do avoid using a directed voice in favor of keeping my documentation
neutral.  If you did read the remainder of that post, you would have read
that I said "Whatever stance you choose, as you noticed, you should be
consistent." 

You are very bizarre and your arguments do not have a clear point and seem
to serve no purpose but to be annoying.  Additionally, you have launched
insults at me. I have only discussed my position and I have not made a
derogatory remark against a specific person for arguing an opposing side.  I
may have attacked arguments, but I have not attacked people.  When a person
changes the argument from a discussion of the subject to an attack on a
person, then that person thinks he is losing the argument and no longer has
a case.  Therefore, since you have personally attacked me at the end of your
post, I will accept that as an admission that you believe you no longer have
a case.

Lauren

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Combs, Richard [mailto:richard -dot- combs -at- Polycom -dot- com] 
> Sent: Monday, February 05, 2007 11:23 AM
> To: Lauren; Techwr-l
> Subject: RE: The 'user' in User Manual
> 
> Lauren wrote: 
>  
> > I have never in my entire life heard, read, or been 
> familiar with the 
> > phrase "2nd person imperative."  To be quite honest, I do not know 
> > what it means.
> > It has never been fully defined in this thread to the extent that I 
> > would remember the definition and it is not used in
> 
> I think it's too bad that schools and colleges no longer 
> teach grammar, but that's just me. I'm sorry that my brief 
> descriptions didn't help you, but I did include links to 
> detailed definitions and discussions of both person and mood 
> at Wikipedia. 
> 
> > everyday speech.  (I am also not interested in learning this term, 
> > once again, it is not used in everyday
> > speech.)  I am, however, familiar with writing and voice.  
> 
> Well, we weren't discussing the weather or Super Bowl. The 
> topic was how one should write user guides. The choice of 
> person and mood are key aspects of this. I don't restrict 
> myself to everyday terms when describing software 
> configuration -- why must I do so when describing the 
> mechanics of writing? 
> 
> > When I use familiar terms to describe a concept, rather 
> than textbook 
> > terms, then I am not wrong.  But your defense over terms 
> that I have 
> > never heard is very odd to me.  What you are saying is that 
> you cannot 
> > understand a concept, unless I use a textbook term.  <snip>
> 
> Your "familiar terms" confused more than one of us because 
> you give them your own unique meanings. I'm sorry that you've 
> never been introduced to the "textbook terms" -- the 
> textbooks they're in are books that teach English grammar and 
> composition, and that's the field of knowledge we're 
> discussing, isn't it?  
> 
> I'm also somewhat amused that someone with a university email 
> address would be so negative about "textbook terms." Don't 
> they appreciate "book learnin'" at Sacramento State? 
>  
> > Please cite the message where, as you say, I said "Don't use 2nd 
> > person voice."
> 
> 2/2/2007, 1:52 PM:
> > connotation.  I take a neutral stance in my writing and avoid 1st 
> > ("I"), 2nd ("you"), and 3rd ("user") person voices.
> 
> Again, I'm sorry that my attempts to clarify the discussion 
> and add to your understanding upset you. But, frankly, I 
> don't understand your insistence on making your ignorance 
> into a virtue. 
> 
> Richard

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